It Takes a Nation of Torturers to Hold Us Back
I suppose I should take a bow.
For eight long years (years that passed like centuries for the misérables rotting in cages at Guantánamo and Bagram and Abu Ghraib and Diego Garcia and Bulgaria and the U.S. Navy’s fleet of prison ships) no one cared about torture. Law professors, politicians, and journalists justified it. Even liberals didn’t care: there wasn’t one major protest march against beating or raping or drowning people to death. Strange but true: the only forces raging against the collective madness that warped the American psyche after 9/11 were human rights organizations and a couple of cartoonists.
The syndicated political cartoonist Matt Bors and I took point, repeatedly ridiculing and ranting about the Bush Administration’s torture policies and Americans’ tacit tolerance of it in cartoons we knew would be reprinted in only a handful of publications. Editors and readers advised us to “stop obsessing” and “move on.” Award committees passed us over in favor of cartoonists who bought Bush’s tall tales about WMDs in Iraq. We were blackballed.
At least they didn’t shove a flashlight up my ass. That is a favorite interrogation tactic at Gitmo (and Bagram, where Obama plans to send the Gitmo victims next).
Perhaps the declassification of CIA documents revealing that the CIA waterboarded one man 183 times (why not 182? Why not 184?) prompted Americans’ newfound distaste for taxpayer-funded dungeons. Maybe it was the juvenile stupidity displayed by Bush’s legal eagles: “As we understand it, you plan to inform Zubaydah that you are going to place a stinging insect into the box, but you will actually place a harmless insect in the box, such as a caterpillar,” one memo said. Because, you know, they don’t have caterpillars in the Northwestern Frontier Province.
Whatever the cause, better late than never (though not for the dozens of fathers, brothers and sons murdered in American torture chambers), but things have come full circle. Americans are against torture again. Some Congressmen are calling for investigations into Bush’s war crimes. President Obama, forced to backpedal on his infamous inclination to “move forward” rather than compel the CIA’s goons to “look over their shoulders” while applying electrodes to the genitals of 14-year-old Afghan boys, seems amenable to throwing the Dirty Half Dozen–the six Bushie lawyers including John Yoo, Jay Bybee and Alberto Gonzáles–to the tender mercies of a special prosecutor.
My favorite aspect of the discussion involves whether or not torture works. “High value information came from interrogations in which those methods were used and provided a deeper understanding of the Al Qaeda organization that was attacking this country,” Obama’s national intelligence director argued last week. Key suspects “provided much valuable information under less severe treatment, and the harsher handling produced no breakthroughs,” countered The New York Times about the newly released documents.
I don’t care if torture works. I don’t give a damn if torture could reveal a plot that would cost millions of lives. I would rather die in a terrorist attack than live in a society that relies upon torture to protect itself. But what do I know? Maybe I’ve just been brainwashed by my Christian upbringing.
As I wrote two weeks ago, the Dirty Half Dozen lawyers ought to be prosecuted for constructing an illegal CYA framework to justify heinous acts by government torturers. An attorney who perverts logic and the law as follows is far too dangerous to be allowed to walk among free men: “Although we do not equate a person who voluntarily enters a weight-loss program with a detainee subjected to dietary manipulation as an interrogation technique, we believe that it is relevant that several commercial weight-loss programs available in the United States involve similar or even greater reductions in caloric intake.”
An officer of the court who doesn’t pack up his office supplies and type up a resignation letter rather than write the following suffers from both psychosis and stupidity: “Although the abdominal slap technique might involve some minor physical pain, it cannot, as you have described it to us, be said to involve even moderate, let alone severe, physical pain or suffering.” Do a Google Image search on John Yoo, author of many of the Torture Memos: the pudgy little pig would break down in tears if he ran out of hand lotion.
Jail the lawyers, preferably for life. But don’t forget their bosses. As has been amply documented, Bush, Cheney, Rice, Powell, Rumsfeld and others personally signed off on specific acts of torture. They ordered the Dirty Half Dozen to draft those memos to provide them with legal cover.
Lawyers don’t write law; they interpret it. If a corporate executive relies on bad legal advice, he goes to jail. Hiring a crappy lawyer isn’t a defense. Bush and his war council should spend the rest of their lives at Guantánamo. Since he’s continuing Bush’s detention policies, so should Obama.
And let’s not forget the CIA and military torturers, the so-called little fish. As servicemen learn during training, it is illegal to follow an illegal order. An order to torture or abuse prisoners of war violates U.S. law and international treaty obligations, as well as international law. When given such an order, it is every person’s moral and legal obligation to refuse it, even if means facing a court-martial. Everyone involved with torture deserves prosecution, including the physicians and psychologists who sat in on sessions that involved “harsh interrogation techniques.”
At the Nuremberg trials that followed World War II, hatemongers like the Jew-baiting newspaper publisher Julius Streicher were prosecuted for promoting racist Nazi ideology. Surely an analogy can be found for right-wing torture fans like Sean Hannity and Rush Limbaugh, who repeatedly fanned the anti-Muslim hatred that led to our current shame. Even Bill Maher, libertarian-cum-liberal post-ABC firing, was pro-torture after 9/11.
In the end, of course, we are all to blame. It was the American people’s moral obligation to rise up as one against a government that carried out torture in our name. Yet we didn’t lift a finger. If only there was a prison big enough to hold all of us.
COPYRIGHT 2009 TED RALL
34 Comments.
Ted, this is one of the best columns I have read. My hat is off to you.
You did leave out one important group of those who knew about torture, but still supported it- the legislators. They all deserve impeachment and prosecution. Not one torturer should be left in the executive, legislative or judicial branches- even if we have to have Speaker Kucinich and Minority Leader Paul.
Right on Ted.
A prison big enough? I seem to recall that during the Bush years, when outrage followed on outrage so fast it was hard to keep track, they established a new rule:
Citizens must now get permission to leave the country.
Did anything ever come of that? Am I just remembering some proposal that didn't go through? If it did, has it been repealed? Just one more thing to scratch my head and worry about.
But yeah, that would be a big enough prison, and quite apt.
anon @ 4/23 7:40pm; If they take your passport, then you are practically incapable of leaving the continent.
And Ted, moving column.
And congrats on the BBC exposure.
Harass Jon Stewart to put you on. And tease him about all the neo-conservatives he's given space to.
y_s
You had me until the "big enough prison" line. Don't ever equate us, the relatively powerless who never voted for Bush and cheered you on as you used your position to speak out publicly against torture and even started in on Obama at 12:01 1/20/09 when he began to do nothing even though we might have overlooked our distaste for Democrats too and voted for him out of fear of Sarah Palin, with them again.
Other than that glaring lapse in logic, best column ever.
Also, Speaker of the House Kucinich and Minority leader Paul sounds fine to me. They can even switch back and forth every two years for all I care.
Patting yourself on the back much? How can you say only human rights organizations and cartoonists were the only ones against torture? What about leftist organizations?
And what constitutes a "major protest or march". I guess if it's seemingly small or insignificant, it doesn't really count, huh? I guess a CNN (or some other outlet of journalistic integrity) report is the only thing that matters…
I'll concede that a majority of people were and continue to be ambivalent towards it. But discounting those who are trying to mobolize against these atrocities only serves to demoralize and weaken an already tiny movement! Throw out some kind of bone!
However, everything else is of excellent quality as always.
To be honest, I'm kinda dissapointed in the beginning and end of the article, Mr. Rall.
Of course, you're correct about Yoo and the (excellently named) "Dirty Half Dozen". And I could agree with the goal of getting superiors in the WH and ground level torturers. But Ted, isn't the big question what the American people say and do ourselves?
It's great to try to prosecute the guilty, but as you point out in the article, isn't every last one of us slightly responsible for allowing this to occur? In the same manner we pillory the German civilians?
I'm glad you don't mind millions being murdered so that you don't have to live so called torture. If you want to be killed, go right ahead, but don't volunteer others to die so you can feel better about yourself.
Ted, I heard that you got laid off, and my heart pumps pure KoolAid for you. I hope that you never find work again and that you die a pauper. May your grave go unmarked, and may a thousand dogs drag their asses across your grave so that your miserable lying corpse may serve a real purpose to some life form.
It's jackholes like you who for your own amusement slander those who go in harm's way so that you may scribble your screeds without fear of reprisals worse than this joyful celebration of your dismissal. I left the wire on a daily basis, sometimes living among the Afghans for months at a time, and I put some of those miserable bastards whom you pity in Bagram's prison. I also met those who cared for them on a daily basis, and I can tell you that you don't know what you're talking about, at least as far as Bagram is concerned. You defame those servicemen whose job it is to coddle the slime we captured. What they had to put up while maintaining their professionalism was ridiculous. But they did it. Their reward is your tired lies.
You don't have the balls to print anything this critical of your sublime self, but at least I know that you will see it, and once again demonstrate your cowardice by refusing to print it.
May you die in miserable poverty, your day in the sun faded like an old cartoon on weathered newsprint. Screaming. And may the devil know you're coming a half an hour before you die.
** Applause **
It's all true. How did it come to this? Unquestionably we're the most advanced nation in the world, technologically, and yet rip away a few laurels that we were resting on, as Osama did eight years ago, and underneath we're all just bloodthirsty cavemen. Rip away some phony ledger pages and our sophisticated financial and investment system turns out to be run by Nathan Detroit. As they used to say on Star Trek, our social development hasn't kept pace with our technological development. Regressed, in fact, I'd venture to guess. When right-wingers say this country has decayed from within, they're completely right, but for utterly the wrong reasons.
How can you say only human rights organizations and cartoonists were the only ones against torture? What about leftist organizations?And YOU forgot the libertarians. The real ones, not the phony right-wing Glenn Beck ones. Unlike some "leftist organizations" from history, they've always been for human rights.
And to "Afghan Veteran", there's a special place in hell for people who willingly sign up to kill people who never attacked our country. Enjoy it! Maybe Toby Keith will do USO performances there.
Dear So-Called "Afghan Veteran",
So you worked at Bagram. If so, then that makes you a torturer by default.
And don't you ever, EVER talk to Ted Rall about Afghanistan. He was there in 2001, right in the middle of the fighting, getting the bombs dropped on him.
You, on the other hand, were sitting in your comfy Army Base playing prison warden. You know NOTHING about Afghanistan, or Afghans.
"Afghan Veteran", my ass.
Smith, my statement wasn't trying to be all inclusive (as opposed to the article). It was just illustrating a point that Mr. Rall is completely discounting other organizations.
Talk about missing the forest for the trees…
Lollin' at that last one, Stark. If he is actually an Afghan vet, he probably knows at least a little more about it than you do. Comfy Army base, indeed.
so-called Susan… I'd like for you to come outside the wire with me and into the Redzone here in Iraq, you know, the section of Iraq where the VBIEDs and IEDs flip our vehicles and kill soldiers so those who cowardly hide behind a pen and the internet can scream bloody baby killer to us.
This fricking idiot cartoonist did not leave the gate. I can guarantee he could not even find the gate. All he knew was where the chow hall and PX were located.
Nancy Pelosi even knew of the information extraction methods back then, makes her an accomplice. By her "not doing anything" makes her "guilty".
You all don't understand terrorists from the comments you are writing. Regardless how Lovey Dovey you sound "self-styled" Revrant and "Susan", Islam believes in the Noncoexistance of nonislam faith.
The islam stayes they can not coexist with infadels as their neighbors, they will kill you if you do not pay a tax and make the traditional concessions to them. For one example, to have a building of worship, it has to be built into the ground so all those can look up at islam and those on top can look down. There are more examples.
Unfortunately, you all do not have th guts and balls to confront the bad guy. You mock those of us in the miltiary (I'm an MP), yet, when something horrific happens, you want those same souls you mocked and called baby killers to go out and protect you.
The Afghan Veteran might be careful about wishing "miserable poverty" on anyone. Given that the same administration that sent him to Afghanistan also borked the economy… The same economy he, Ted and the rest of us rely upon.
Concerning the ending of the article, I was a bit disappointed as well. I don't have the exposure that Mr. Rall has and I don't have a huge audience, but I have spoken out against torture during this entire era, occasionally in the face of people like "Afghan Veteran". There were many of us who spoke up, didn't vote for Bush, and will also hold Obama up for scrutiny, if he continues to try to sweep it under the rug, as well. We don't deserve to be lumped in with those who still to this day deny that there is anything wrong or want to "move forward and not get mired in the past". That said, I also think that collectively we are all still responsible to correct the bad actions taken by our government. This would prove to be difficult if we were all put in jail…
But why stop here? Ignoring torture is a really bad symptom of a far worse disease. Just the other day I spoke with a woman who is seventy five years old, stricken with cancer and living on the street. People walked by her like she didn't even exist. In our streets there are thousands who suffer constantly. There is little to no help for them. As a culture we turn away from them like we turn away from our deeds in Afghanistan and Iraq. Some of us turn away because we are cowards. Some of us turn away because we secretly believe that somehow the folks living in the streets "deserve" it. Some of us turn away because we think, wrongly, that there is nothing we can do.
This is the day to day violence that we inflict upon ourselves. The horror that some of us, like "Afghan Veteran" gleefully wish upon our enemies.
America has become a country wracked by it's own mindless fear and brutality. There is a way back, but it will not be easy. We have to take a good long look at what we have become, our violent and destructive history, and spend the rest of our lives, for a few generations, fixing what we can of it. After World War Two the Germans began this process and have become a far better people because of it. Looking at your own ugly viciousness is never pleasant, never easy. If we don't start soon, we're lost.
Smokegenerator:
First of all, knock it off about the "self-styled Revrant [sic]". My ordainment by the Universal Life Church is for life and I take it very seriously.
Second of all, why do conservatrons always trot out the fact that Nancy Pelosi was complicit in torture? I'm sure she was, I have no loyalty to her and if she knew more than she's letting on, she should rot in a cell too.
Third of all, I'm far from "lovey dovey". Organized religion is a cancer on civilization, and Islam gets no free pass from me. However, even when Saudi nationals fly planes into our buildings (killing one of my former in-laws, by the way), I don't get filled with blood lust and sign up to ship off to IRAQ and kill Ay-rabs.
I'm in no way anti-military. I know what's out there and as per the Constitution, the military should be here, DEFENDING the country.
Fourth of all, you're the "bad guy". Stay safe. I'm sure you'll put that socialized education to good use when you get back.
To: Afghan War Vet
I sincerely pity you that your experience in life have turned you into such a piece of shit. Any more of a man would feel quiet dignity and pride to live in a country where a plurality of views can be expressed. I'm sorry the military didn't make you less of a coward to spew such hateful indignation at others. I'm sorry that the likes of you are a US ambassador to the world. Almost all the veterans I know personally are outstanding and compassionate individuals for their experiences, it makes me wonder if you're real.
I emailed you on two occasions, earlier in this past decade, encouraging you to look closer at the 911 tragedy (the pretext for the devolution of human rights and the rise of American Imperialism) specifically the media's masking of the September 11th demolition of three structures in the WTC complex, buildings number 1,2 and 7. I shared this link http://www.ae911truth.org to the research of dedicated architects and engineers like myself. No response — blown off as a 'conspiracy' nut, I assumed.
Since that infamous day, myself, and many others like me continue to beat the drums of truth relentlessly, for the investigation (now re-investigation) of 'Cheney's Pearl Harbor'. Not much help from you, not a word.
The 911 aftermath, two bogus wars and the subsequent murderous reign of terror and torture you blame us all for, could have been avoided, if the noise of truth were louder than the din of lies and jingoistic patriotism. The media blinded American People were led into a manufactured world of terror and distorted realities and too few chose to look deeper into BushCo's box of mirrors.
I admire your tenacious, undaunted dedication to calling these ugly, deluded sociopaths for what they are, and I understand your notion of passive complicity, but I caution your use of a blanket conviction.
Smokegenerator1811
Yes, you are a hero in the eyes of many, and yes to some, the military, specifically those members now engaged in the two current occupations, are thought of as baby killers, water boarders… the list goes on.
But that's the nature of this beast — war brings out the best of some and the worst of others.
You're angry because you chose to be where you are and we didn't make the same decision. You sound like you hate us, so why did you make such a noble commitment?
I was drafted, get over it.
"we didn't lift a finger. If only there was a prison big enough to hold all of us."
Wiretaps, RFID ID cards, cell-phone tracking, watch lists, internet monitoring, institutional lawlessness. . .the US is already halfway to becoming a free-range prison
Susan Stark: Learn to read, sweetheart. I lived among the Afghans for most of my time in Afghanistan. I captured men who wound up in Bagram's prison, and who seriously deserved to be there. I also met the men and women who guarded and treated the prisoners at Bagram, and you and your pal are lying about them.
It's funny that your unemployed cartoonist was getting bombs dropped on him in 2001, since the Taliban didn't have an air force. So that's bullshit. I, on the other hand, lost friends both American and Afghan. All of them were better than Rall and certainly better than you. At least they contributed something, tried to do something. Sitting here stateside making up lies about the people who work at the detention facility on Bagram is not adding anything but smoke to the air, and not getting a thing in the world actually done.
One last point. If those men who I put in Bagram had turned the tables on me, I would have wound up on a beheading snuff film on terroristmedia.com. At least we take prisoners.
Your doubting my service record will never take a thing away from me. Happily, your misguided cries for "justice" fall on deaf ears as well. That doesn't make you less offensive; it just makes you harmless. Now, may you both lose all you own and waste away.
As you proved with your asinine comment, the truth can be right in front of you and you will ignore it. Pathetic.
Why is a Nazi torturer getting space on this page to promote his philosophy and his organization? Don't they have enough websites and TV channels of their own?
Isn`t it remarkable, the similarities of writing style in service personnel serving in Afghanistan and those serving in the Iraq Redzone. Almost as if it were in fact the same angry person.
Outside the wire indeed…
"It's funny that your unemployed cartoonist was getting bombs dropped on him in 2001, since the Taliban didn't have an air force. So that's bullshit"
They were American bombs, "Afghan" "Veteran."
Too bad the military doesn't require reading comprehension.
Yeah, I'm more convinced that "afghan veteran" is neither. Think about it, what actual veteran of combat would spend their time seething on blogs at the Un-Americans they begrudgingly put their lives in harm's way to protect?
Like I said in a previous post, there's only one veteran I've met who actually fits that Iron Man "candidate for right wing extremism" (as DHS puts it) stereotype of a "you owe me, PEASANT" bully, and he left the service over 15 years ago, and is a bona fide militant alcoholic.
I don't think this guy is real, I've never seen a veteran preach about the things they did, even the militant alcoholic wouldn't even acknowledge WHERE he'd been, just "lotsa places" -even after 10 or 15 drinks. I think this guy plays Call of Duty too much, because in my experience, real combat experience reduces this jingoistic assaholism, not amplifies it.
I think he's an angry "state side" republican who increasingly can't defend his moronic and shallow worldview, so he invents the idea that he's a veteran to gain some sort of credibility. It actually makes him more of a sad basket case, not less.
I have friends and family who are or have been in the Army, Air Force, and Marine Corps. When I get on my socialist-leftist soap box with the more conservative of them, they simple smile and chuckle. Not a single one of them is a hot head.
Henceforth, I will refer to Afghan Veteran as "Troll."
Afghan Veteran
"Isn`t it remarkable, the similarities of writing style in service personnel serving in Afghanistan and those serving in the Iraq Redzone. Almost as if it were in fact the same angry person."
Flamingo Bob noted this peculiarity and I've found this is to be a common thread running through the occupation forces. While there are many members of 'our' armed services, both active and inactive, who would totally disagreed with your simplistic analysis of both the process and principles of the occupation of Afghanistan and Iraq, belligerent dullards like yourself make the most noise. You lack the intellect to rationally evaluate your situation, one you have willfully chosen,and therefore rely on testosterone and inflated ego to reassure yourself every fucking towel head you put away is a terrorist.
"Your doubting my service record will never take a thing away from me. Happily, your misguided cries for "justice" fall on deaf ears as well. That doesn't make you less offensive; it just makes you harmless. Now, may you both lose all you own and waste away."
Your record is irrelevant, your ideology is what I fear. Your behavior, whether exemplary or reprehensible is known only to you, your officers and comrades — I don't care about you personally. You've made it clear you don't care about me, or anyone who disagrees with you.
What you stand for sickens me. Your self righteous indignation speaks of a small mind, a closed mentality of black and white realities — the horror is that there are many others like you. That is what makes you frightening, your collective's hateful delusion.
"As you proved with your asinine comment, the truth can be right in front of you and you will ignore it. Pathetic."
You would know, now wouldn't you. Your pathetic idea of truth lies right in front of you — your gun sights.
I agree with Flamingo Bob and William, I think this is the same troll, the arguments are consistent, the styles are very similar.
Also, soldiers in 'our' armed forces are trained in things like situational awareness. I just find it really hard to believe that this is coming from a recent veteran. Most likely not a veteran at all. No soldier would insult their uniform in such a manner.
Count me on board with the theory that "Afghan Veteran" and "Smokegenerator" are the same frustrated chicken hawk.
He wouldn't claim to be an MP if he was fakin' it though, would he? And they do tend to be angry & defensive since everyone hates them.
I don't think so, Sean. He doesn't actually say that he's an MP, he makes allusions to both working at Bagram and "putting people there," which seem like two very separate and mutually exclusive things.
With regard to the Iraq redzone one. What the hell is a soldier in a combat situation doing blogging on here? I have two close friends who each spent over a year in Iraq, and their communications were monitored and restricted. It's possible they eased those by now, but still I just don't buy that an active duty soldier in Iraq would be blogging, especially on here.
The writing style and vitriol suggest that this is a person who frequents this blog often, and yet both handles just HAPPEN to show up for the first time now? Give me a break, this is the same troll time and time again.
Hey Afghan vet, which way to the beerhall???
"If only there was a prison big enough to hold all of us."
Ted doesn't think we're living in a figurative prison now? We've been in prison since Gore wimped out on challenging the 2000 election and we got Bush for eight years. Think it's paranoid to worry that contacting the White House would exercise its long reach to citizens courageous enough to express criticism? Recall how Nixon used the IRS to get back at his enemies? Government and due process take a very long time, and while a person is starving or in one of Bush's political prisons…ah, nuts! We're fucked, and the Bush apologists are working full-time to make Obama fail. Ted, you could have run for President. Hannity wouldn't really care to be waterboarded. Who would really want to give a try at the Presidency? It's very quiet out there.